Rice Acknowledges Bad Iraq Decisions

Secretary of State-designate Condoleezza Rice, in a rare acknowledgment of mistakes, said on Wednesday the Bush administration had made some bad decisions in Iraq and was unprepared for stabilizing the country.
From Nony

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Gunther Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 09:39 AM :
The first crack in the wall!

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 10:16 AM :
Find me a former administration who has not made mistakes. Especialy in war time.

I challenge any to come up with even one in the last 90 years to be flawless...

That does include Clinton's administration.

Alice Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 10:21 AM :
Bush's mistakes have cost thousands upon thousands lives. The last president to do that was .. well, Kennedy through Nixon.

Sky Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 1:47 PM :
What else was she to do? Joe Biden and Barbara Boxer had obviously been instructed to serve as whips for the democrats during the hearings and they came prepared. Everytime she tried to skirt something, they had evidence readily at hand. I don't think the Demos have a lot of problems with Rice on spec. All but two (Biden and Boxer) voted to send her nomination to the floor. Rather, I think the Demos used the opportunity to state their disgust with the way they had been deliberately mislead by the administration. Joe Biden told Condi yesterday that it isn't a matter of their having made mistakes - every administration makes them. What bothers him is that they have steadfastly refused to acknowledge those mistakes, take corrective action, and more importantly, state that they would repeat them if they had it to do again. What was telling was that the Republican members of the committee didn't seem to have any objection to the Demo's strategy and even followed up on it, albeit with a bit less acid. This makes perfect sense, though. The Senate tends to be a bit more level-headed than the House and the Republicans understand that they may have to distance themselves from Bush, so they don't want to appear as if they are in his pocket.

Gunther Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 2:11 PM :
And there is the 2006 election on the horizon!

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 4:33 PM :
Alice thousands upon thousands? Like that supposed to mean something? What kind of mistake was Vietnam? Crap girl! We lost that war. How many died in that war? Just to loose at the end with nothing to show for it.

But oh Bush winds this one in Afghanistan, and Iraq is almost done, but some how his terms in office overshadow the past admins mistakes. Get a grip people. It can very easily be argued that many of past administrations mistakes cost thousands upon thousands. I still have yet to hear any of Bushes critics come up with a more safe and less costly way to deal with loosing 3k CIVILIAN lives. Nothing but dogmatic and baseless critisism from people who can from hindsight judge the decisions of others, but are unable to solve the same problem that Bush had to deal with.

What would have been better? HAH?! What send a ship near the cost and launch a bunch of missles out into Iraq to take out some anti radar stations, or blow up a munitions warehouse like CLinton. WOW!! What an amazing acheivement that was, we still have the problem left after that. Now atleast we are forcing the enemy to come out. The same enemy I might add that has been around long before Bush or 9-11-01. So where is the great answer folks? Any one?

Why are you sore looser freaks still sobbing in your tears and crying wolf? EVERY ONE thought Sadam had nukes!! Every one !!! Even Kerry before that jellyfish kept changing his mind at the drop of a hat. And just because we did not find them yet doesnt mean he did not have them. Just because you dont see them doesnt mean they dont exsist!! Duuhhh! Its a little possibility that they were barried like alot of other crap he tried to hide. Even yes even if we have not found any of the bigger weapons yet, they could still be right under our noses. Dang people!!! Its not like he could not have smuggled them to a neighboring country or anything. Oh no, that could mean you are wrong for being ignorantly judgmental of Bush for no reason, so that idea can not even be probable can it now???

The only legit complain the world can have about anything in this war is the disgust at Abu Garab. Period. But even that is so stupid. To actualy blame an administation for what 7 or 8 chemicaly unballenced over driven killer soldiers did, still missing the mark by a huge margine.

And geuss what? As long as the Democratic party or those favoring democratic political candidates keep trying to wallow in the mud of made up and over exagerated accusations then, in 2006 you will watch your Hillary Clinton loose by and even larger margine. Watch and see.

Crap! The dems keep blaming Bush for not winning the hearts of the Iraqis. But they are so stupid for not seeing that they cant even tell whats in the hearts of America. But as long as the platform is still pointing fingers at others and not doing better, then the Dem party will be known as the loosing party.

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 4:38 PM :

Lets not forget we took out 4 WMDs already from Iraq.

Chemical Ali


and his two sons

Come on and defend that these guys were not Weapons or tools of mass distruction. I dare you!!

Alice Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 4:40 PM :
I must say, I blame both parties. You can choose to not believe me, but it's what I think. I'm not a democrat, never have been. In my opinion, the present democratic party is going through a major identity crisis. They are trying cover all bases and please all people all the time, but only end leaving folks rather unsatisfied.

I personally never believed that Saddam had weapons. I remember when it first came on the news. I looked at Darren and said "can you believe this shit?", he said "no fucking way" (we're a bit crude round the house). We had to wait nearly 2 years for the truth to come out .. but oh well. We new that Iraq had disarmed ten years ago. It was the first US invasion that prompted that. We fucked them up so bad that they never recovered.

Anyway .. I'm done ranting.

Alice Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 4:41 PM :
Come on, that's being rather loose with the definition of WMD. Yes, they were bad men, but they aren't chemical or nuclear weapons. That country had no capabilities .. and now everyone knows it.

Sky Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 4:47 PM :
There's nothing to defend. PoPo. You made the moronic comment, so you defend it. You can't because it's childish and petty.

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/20/2005 6:48 PM :
I will defend it Sky. Sadam killed more people under his rule than we have since we have been in there. The torture and murders that never ended is just being brushed under the rug by all those who choose to hate America and or the Bush administration. Its called sellective hearing. If a single man has and uses his power to kill all the people in his country who want only to be free, he is not considered dangerous enough to dethrown? I agree that we should be just as agresive in African countries and are dropping the ball in a uge way by ignoring that and turning to where the oil is. But we also need to take into consideration what economic crisis can be done by a tirrant who has the worlds most oil reserves. He proved his intent by invading Iran. Somr just choose to see what they want. Sadam had so much money all the time, it did not phase him one bit when we pushed them out of Iran. They recovered fine with all the money from Oil sales, and UN fraud. I challeng any of you to go meet some one who has lived the common life in Iraq. Some one who did not agree with Sadam and let them tell you what they lost, and who they lost just for not agreeing. Tell them Sadam did not need to be taken out of power one way or another, and soon.

Nony Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 02:46 AM :
Who has selective hearing?

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 08:31 AM :
I guess its seen the same from both sides of the issue.

If years from now. They could dissprove that Sadam never gased entire villages, there were no nuclear plants, and that it was all a farse, then I will agree that we have been completely lied to. I can stand in your shoes. As of right now, not enough time has been given to actualy searching for the hidden weapons, all the man power is given to war. SO stories of claims that nothing is found yet is to hasty to pass judgement.

I aske however, if years from now, they find a barried missle bunker with a lot filled with long ranger nuclear tipped warheads, or war heads laced with nuclear or biological material, in Iraq, would you then see that the truth was brought up front from the start, and agree that we were not lied to?

Gunther Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 08:37 AM :
Morning PoPo!

How many years are we going to wait? They have been looking for these WMD since after Gulfwar I, give it a break man. If he had them, we would have found them.

Your loyalty towards the elected goverment is commendable man!

Alice Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 08:37 AM :
This is how I see it. When they said we were going to war, they said that not only were there weapons, but that they knew where they were. If they knew where they were, well, shouldn't they have been there? You see, thats where the lie is .. or at the very least, major mistake.

If they find something buried out in the desert, well, they'll have just gotten lucky. If they had said "we know they have weapons, they're buried in the desert", I would buy that if they found them.

Sky Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 10:09 AM :
PoPo, I congratulate you on your response. Let's discuss this further.

"Sadam killed more people under his rule than we have since we have been in there."

This may be true. I have never seen any figures on how many of his own people he murdered. Given that he tried to exterminate the Kurds, I would imagine that the number is large. No one can deny that Saddam was a brutal bastard. Yet he brutalized his people for years and the US turned an official blind eye to it because we needed him to keep the pressure in Iran. We have a sad history of doing this. Bush currently is turning a blind eye on a number of brutal dictators. For example, Bush has condemed the genocide being visited on the Sudanese people by their government, but is completely unwilling to do anything to stop it. I posted several days ago that the same thing is happening in Equitorial Guinea and, in that case, not only does Bush not have anything to say about it, his administration is quietly assisting American oil companies open trade with that government. The oil companies are in turn assisting the EG goverment. It isn't that Bush has dropped the ball in Africa; he's proving that he's quite willing to prop up a genocidal government and put his blinders on to serve his unspoken agenda. So it is you who is practicing "selective hearing." You hear only what Bush and his propaganda machine says to you and ignore all other voices. This is precisely what they want you to do. Accept a simple rhetorical answer and don't ask any questions.

"...people in his country who want only to be free..."

Again you're spouting Bush Propaganda. Did anyone ask the Iraqi people what they want? No. We just invaded, toppled their government, destroyed their infrastructure, and did so in so half-assed a way that we failed to secure the country against the inevitable insurgency that would insue. We've been there two years now and the highway between Bahgdad and it's airport is still too dangerous to travel without an armed military escort. Major parts of Bahgdad, Mosul, Fallujah, and other cities lay in ruins. In many parts of the country, the Iraqi people still get as little as two hours of electricity per day. The insurgency is alive, well, and growing stronger. Terrorists from all ove the region are pouring into Iraq. We are powerless to stop it because Bush refuses to put more troops on the ground there. Hence, the violence will continue there indefinitely and we will be stuck, as we were in Vietnam, fighting an unending war of attrition. Utlimately, it is the Iraqi people who suffer.

I just love it when the Bushites start spouting this freedom cry. Bush couldn't care less about the Iraqi people or their freedom. He's there to grab their oil; I raq sits on 15% of the world's known oil reserves and Bush wants to have control of it. So far, the only entity to benefit in any way from the situation in Iraq is Haliburton Corp. Bush's doctrine isn't about freedom; it's about empire. Everyone in the world sees this and they resent it deeply.

You challenge me to "to go meet some one who has lived the common life in Iraq." I've already met that challenge. In the early and mid-1970s, the United States trained members of both the Iraqi and Iranian Air Force at Lackland and Kelly Air Force Bases. I was stationed there at the time. I came to know many Iraqis. I know them to be a good, moral and deeply religious people. I spent many hours talking with them. We didn't talk of politics. No one ever called me a infidel. They were not Islamic extremist; they were just boys in the service of their country.. They were hungry to learn about us and our culture, though they found much of it puzzling.

I hope you will understand the implications of what I've just written. We were supplying and training Saddam's military. Officially, our purpose was to foster stability in the region and deter any possible Soviet expansion there. We officially supported Saddam's regime. At about the time, I was cahtting with Iraqi airmen in San Antonio, Saddam was consolidating power in Iraq. About a year ago, I saw a film that was shot during an address Saddam gave to the Iraqi general assembly, wherein he was telling them about some new policies he was implementing. It was easy to tell that the delegates were nervous. One man stood and queried Saddam about the wisdom of one of his policies. In response, Saddam nodded to one of his guards, who walked over to the man, pulled his pistol, and shot him un the head. Saddam smiled and asked if anyone else had anything to say. The incident was shot by a journalist in 1974. All we heard at the time was that Saddam was our good friend and ally.

So you can understand that I have no argument with you about what an evil man Saddam is. An compelling argument can be made that he needed to be removed from power. But we must acknowledge our own complicity in putting him in power. If we are to to help the Iraqi people by removing him for them, we have a moral responsibility to do so correctly and in such a way that they aren't made to suffer. We have failed miserably in this regard because our motivation is impure. If we really cared about Iraqis' freedom, we would not be imposing an American-style democracy on them, but would allow them, as a self-determinant people, to choose the form of government they desire. What we are doing is dictating to them how they will govern themselves. Dictating, PoPo.

How the tables have turned. Another of Bush's many ironies is his newfound dedication to spreading feedom and democracy around the globe. He is posturing as the champion for human rights. The Republicans have jumped on his bandwagon. When Jimmy Carter was president, the conservatives attacked him brutally. That damned, misguided, bleeding-heart liberal, want to trot around the globe solving everyone's problems for them. He thinks he has some sort of right to put his Christain morality at the heart of US foreign policy. Carter is a neophyte goody-two-shoes, who needs to keep his nose out of other countries internal affairs. Carter would say that the US should be a beacon for morality and freedom that the world could follow and the conservatives would roll their eyes and sneer in disgust. The conservatives couldn't get enough of this Carter bashing. I remember that Carter condemned Saddam for his human rights violations and the conservatives blasted him for it! How dare Carter publicly condemn one of our dearest friends in the Middle East! Even after Carter left office, the conservatives weren't finished with him. They condemed every effort by the Carter Center to foster peaceful political and social reforms around the world, especially in Nicaragua. So maybe you will understand that I mistrust Bush's sudden desire to embrace what is one of the liberal core values that his conservative base has bitterly opposed for so long. I would like to believe that he is earnest, but I suspect that just sheep's clothing to hide the wolf.

PoPo, you've been following these events for just a few of years now. I've been following them for over 30 years. You are following Bush without the background information. I don't mean this as an insult, but only to make the point that only someone who is well-informed can make good decisions on things so critical as this. So I don't want you to take my word on anything I've written here. Just go to your local library and check out a few history books. You'll then see for yourself that the things I've written are true and accurate. I've said before that I believe you are a good, moral man, PoPo. I believe your heart is in the right place. I also believe that you are being manipulated by Bush, Inc. They do not truly share your values in this regard. Rather, they have cloaked their agenda in a pretty wrapper to get buy-in from you and others like you. Bush didn't corner the market on this strategy. Most politicians engage in it. It is for this reason that we must all heed Benjamin Franklin's advice that we must maintain a healthy distrust of our government and never forget that a politician will not shrink from lying to us in order to get his way.

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 11:25 AM :
Sky - you're an idiot. A "healthy distrust for the government" is exactly what the country needs if the government is self-serving! President Bush was elected you moron!! We live in a democracy. No one held a gun to your head at the polls did they? The American people have spoken and made their choice. Mr. Bush was not re-elected because he's a great speaker you dim-witted nincompoop. He was re-elected because he's doing a good job of protecting our country during a dangerous time! Something his predecessor failed miserably at!

News flash for ya - ALL WARTIME LEADERS PRACTICE DECEPTION. Get the fuck over it, you half-brained, whiney, no ball, double speakin', pompous asshole.

"Did anyone ask the Iraqi people what they want? No. We just invaded....."

So, we should conduct an opinion poll of a foreign country and it's people before we protect our interests overseas? How would we go about this Sky? Have Newsweek reporters walk around Baghdad?? The idealism you bloviate is a boy's philosophy. You complain about our country's path, but your alternative is flat out laughable. I hope you don't take yourself seriously...but with your arrogant shellac, I'm sure you do.

And, you think that somehow you own the only view of world history because you remember that we supported Saddam once? That's what countrys do you frickin' moron!! It was in our best interest to support him at the time. Now it isn't. If Great Britan supported terrorists, we'd go after them too! Pull your head out you naive, panty waste.

One of these days when your balls will drop, you will realize that simply sitting around waiting for "something bad to happen" is an irresponsible military strategy to practice, given the world condition we find ourselves in today.

Sky Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 12:08 AM :
Patriot, no one was talking to you, asshole.

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 1:20 PM :
Hey there ya go. Now take that anger and direct it at the real enemy.

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 2:53 PM :
Gunther - We todd did. You are sofa king we todd did.

Alice Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 2:56 PM :
That's one of the weirder things I've ever seen you write Patriot. Congratulations on reaching a new height of crypticness.

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:00 PM :
Did you read it outloud? Save it, and have Darren read it out loud for you tonight. It's frickin' hilarious listening to someone mouth the words and not realize what they're saying. It's Friday, for cryin' out loud. Have a laugh and a beer. Life is good. The sun is shining, the birds are singing, it stopped raining in LA, I have 6 weeks left before I can't sleep anymore, and Sky hasn't posted anymore idealistic drivel for the better part of the morning. LIFE is good!!

Golly Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:04 PM :
Patriot-Life is good. I agree. Sky told me that I can't wake up and look at things this way. Say it out loud? Help me. Golly loves a joke.

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:05 PM :
That's because Sky is we todd did.


Alice Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:06 PM :
I bloody well read it ... you think Gunther is "retarded, so fucking retarded".

I still think it's an odd this to write that way. If you're going to insult someone, say it loud and say it proud.

Golly Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:07 PM :
LMAO. Now I get it. All along, I thought it was a typo.

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:10 PM :
It's a frickin' joke for crying out loud!! Call the frickin' cops on me for having fun why don't you?

Gunther Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:14 PM :
Ha! Ha! Ha!

So 6 weeks and you are "daddy" Man that is cool. Maybe you get a bit mellower then.

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:27 PM :
My wife and I are really looking forward to it. I finished painting the lil' dudes room last night....took me until three AM.

I'm actually, very mellow - just not when lies are sold as the truth by people like Mr. Resume. It's one of my pet peeves in life, I guess you could say. I'm sure I'll have less time to banter with online opinions after da kid arrives.

So you ever thought about asking the HR director out for a few beers, so they get to know you away from the office, and see that you being a pervert isn't anything they should take personally?

Golly Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:33 PM :
Umm...Don't say "HR." No good.

Golly Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:43 PM :
Time-out. Golly is the pervert. That has been established. Golly tried the beer thing with HR but Golly got a 'write-up" for bringing beer into the office.

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 3:50 PM :
sorry, about the HR perv comment Gunther - meant for Golly. Like I said - late night last night...too many paint fumes....too many newcastle brown ales.

Gunther Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 4:02 PM :
OK, just wondering. Didn't make much sense.

Sky Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 4:21 PM :
"We todd did. You are sofa king we todd did."

Now isn't that just too cute? I guess we're back in grade school again. And, damn! The schoolyard bully is still there. How much credence would anyone lend to a mind of this quality?

Golly Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 4:54 PM :
Oh, come on Sky, it's Friday. Oh, wait. I can't use that as an excuse. It is kind of fuuny. Juvenile sure, but funny non-the -less. Sure, this was directed at you but even if it was directed at me, I'd still chuckle? No?

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 5:41 PM :
Have a laugh for once Mr. Resume!! It might feel good to laugh at yourself! Your fantasy world of arrogant intellectualism won't crubble if you have a sense of humor! Truly great minds recognize what's funny because they also recognize what is serious.

How you misunderstood this joke as something serious, only reinforces my perception that you are sofa king, sofa king we todd did.

Alice Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 5:53 PM :
Patriot, I'm beginning to think you might be drunk ...

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 6:01 PM :
Nope. Still at work. Had about (4) beers last night putting the kids room together though. That used to be a warm-up to the warm-up, before I'd head out for a night with the fellas. Now (4) beers is a big whoop around my house.

My wife's friends are throwing her a baby shower this weekend. So we're going to have a lot of out of town company. Odds are, someone's going to get pretty banged up on booze, but it probably won't be me. I try to practice temperance, and with the wife only a few weeks out from the expected delivery date - who knows what could happen. So I need to be at least a half hour from stone cold sober at all times.

You sound like you could use one yourself!! No happy hour tonight with Darren and the work crew?

Golly Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 6:01 PM :
Golly is loaded. Heading to company party. Yes, "HR" will be there. Golly still misses Jimmy. Catch ya all tomorrow.

Patriot Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 6:06 PM :
Buy "HR" a beer and a shot of tequila. Your situation will either improve dramatically or get worse in a hurry.

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 6:13 PM :
Sky you are good at arguing a point only when its being shot for you not against you. I can just as easily argue that nothing was done so far in Iraq not because of your ideas but becasue Iraq is a muslim country and doing something that agressive would very much so have to be with acceptable reasons to other surrounding muslamic nations aproval. And Invading Iran was one such justification. However this last invasion was a bit differant seeing as we have never been through an event as horrific as septembet 11, 2001. Would you not agree that everything changed after that day? even how we deal with countried that dispisse us, and help and or harbor terrorist LIKE Bin Laden?

And your 30 years of observation only proves a point to yourself because it does nothing for me, but thanks for flattering me with an effort to impress me. LOL I see no other point to telling me that. Shhesh. Ha ha ha.

Guys lets not forget that each that opposing and the favoring of Bush see what they want in the desert mirage. Truth or not, we are hated of the Muslamic world -->B*E*F*O*R*E<-- this thing in Iraq started. So break out of the box you keep your selves in and see that nothing changes that fact. WMDs or not, it doesnt matter. We have no other way out of this long brooding bloodthirst for our necks. DANG!

Although it seems odd that none of you can admit that our effort to find anything so ellusive and revered as the precious WMD, was badly delayed through wasted months of bullcrap talk with the scandelous UN who only managed to buy Sadam time to ship out and hide the evidence. Dont you get it? Through wasted talks and empty threats Sadam had a very very long head start. It was because of the UN and idiot nations like France and Germany delaying that cost us the time we needed to bust the case. If it was a drug bust, it would be like the neighborhood pimps get together and blocked the police on a warranted sting and also warning the home owner and drug seller about what was coming. But whatever because you guys wont beleive it no matter what happnes. If they are found or detonated you guys would still have some kind of lie accusation or conspiracy theme going somewhere.

Atleast the so called "Bush Propaganda" makes more sence to more people in America than made up lies about how he is a Nazi, and how America created the terrorists that are coming after us.

You Sky are ignoring that for the large scale of this war it is still the most cleanly fought and most cost effective of all the past wars. You just choose to ignore the fact that in past wars civilian casualties and material loss was so much more than this war will ever be. You choose to live in a delussion your god, Michael Moore, has emagined. Even if parts of his lies were true, and not so grously exagerated, then the soldiers over there would be fighting civilians of Iraq rather than Iranians Egyptians, Jordanians, Pakistans, Serbs and others from outside the ground zero. But another case in which you turn a blind eye. The people of Iraq praise these soldiers and are glad we are actualy sticking around this time. You know the more you talk the more I think you were not a servant in the military.

You are backwards of what you claim to be, I am imagining a bearded towel headed potbelly sucker when you talk. Ala U Akbarr?

I would like to take this opportunity to remind and rubb in the fact that your "party of the people" have no blinded your selves about the condition of this world that you will see another huge loss to a republican. Unless Lieberman runs. In which case you are still screwed because he wont sit by and let the Muslim racists destroy Isreal either. You favore the ones who pervert, not the ones who are trying not go into extinction. It doesnt matter who we have in office. Dem or Rep, as long as we help Isreal defend itself from the constant threat from Jew Haters who raise their kids to blow them selves up along with innocent civilians, we will also continue to be a target from Muslim radicals. Like it or not, you can try to twist and spin your pathetic conspiracy melowdrama, but we are fortunate that more real Americans are pissed and angry at being dissrespected and targeted for no reason, NO REASON. Defending Isreals right to not be blown up on a daily basis is not a reason at all!!!

No every one doesnt see this theory of empire after oil madness, only the terrorist who are richly funding this stupidity is causing your dellusion. If it were about oil you wisearse then why dont we have control of Irans oil? What your bright reading on that one. We could have taken rights in that country for what we did. The motive for us going there was oil. But not to take it. It was the implications of what would occure of Sadam got his way there. World dominations was Sadams jock itch not Bushes. You are so ignorant for a Modern Day Einstein. Arent you? You call this a bannana all you want its still not a fruit. You are. Sadam using his oil to effect world ecconomy is a terrible threat and it just passes right by you because you are blinder than the bat Ozzie ate. Who cares what wasnt found. Its proof that hasnt been found YET. You still wont react to the UN scandal that funded Sadam and france took part in it. But want to bash Bush for something that we havent found. You like the sound of your voice Im sure.

Your ridiculous argument that we put Sadam into power is so ignorant its too much to think at once. IF we did put him into power, it doesnt mean we are why he is a MAD FREAKEN MAN!! Were you the same looser yesterday that you were today? No somethings take cultivation. He could have been a decent tirrant 30 years ago. But he got worse and worse. SO now that he is so mean and powerful. Was it actualy your thought that we shout NOT be the ones to remove him from power. I bet you would argue that if we left him there we were wrong for leaving him because we were responsible and should be the ones to take him out. You just choose to stand one materialistic bullogna that suits you at the time. You have no guidance, but self. Ignore the fact Sky that alot of these women can walk around now and not be stoned for their hair showing. Good or bad? What about the fact that women can get an education now, or be divorced with out dieing for it. Who is turning a blind eye now Sky. You act like nothing good is coming out of this. So very one sided.

See thats where you and I are differant. I think Bush is wrong on stuff. Like not making our borders more secure. But If he did you would shout that he is a racist. If he didnt you would argure that he doesnt care about the homeland and is fibbing. I think Bush was an idiot to even start letting the Un think they had a say. Who cares about that fraudulant heap of crooks? He was wrong for not being more agressive at the ellectoral debates. He is far better a pick than J Kerry would have been. At least with Bush even if one doesnt agree with an issue with him, we know where he realy stands. He will tell you. Kerry told everything to every body. Thats not a President thats a coward. Like france. No good bunch of dissrespectful ungrateful wusses. God bless the ones that arent though. They would be a minority.

But in the middle of all my drug indused rant (Lorcet - im sick and in pain) Sky, you still would be fronted in a bold and brightly lit lie or mistake and you are so arrogantly proud of yourself you could not force your self to admit it.

You are a fine polotician my friend, and I agree with your statement, "...never forget that a politician will not shrink from lying to us in order to get his way."

So true the words Sky. Im a simple man uneducated in the art of Polotics that I am a meek individual. Im a blue collor fella, and you are lofty and high above the average man in mind and wit. There for you can only be right and very seldomly wrong Sky, but even more so a great "Polotician" and I add that you have earned my man. Congrats. You have reached your peak of intellect. And now you sit among many many Democrats who lost and most like you still don't recognise why you are loosing "power".

You can not flatter me with kind masked words of you are a kind hearted man. You dont know me and obviously are a bad judge in carractor. I am a mean and strict person. Hated by people at work for my strong convictions of doing the right thing instead of buying friendlyness with exceptions to policy. I am a struggling Christian and cuss loudly at bad drivers. I would slaughter a man with my bare hands if he harmed my family. I am by no means as you say good hearted. Im very much a flawed man. BUT<----------- Atleast I can see it and admit it with out making and excuse.

Carter is only recently doing his world tour island hoping in the name of peace, he did very very little of that when in office. He did go to china though. First American president there right? OH wow I know something. Or am I wrong again?

Patriot its not an "opinion poll" its john kerrys "litmus test" remember?

Just as dumb as the "lock box" gore came up with. Dang

To argue Bushes mistakes is real dull and irrelavent I say. Hind sight is 20/20 and its so easy for some one to critisize him for what he could and and should have done differantly, I will bet that he has more problems with what he could have done differantly than we will ever know, but there are very few un-influencable polaticians out there who would have done better. Especial Sky. Hes probably in bed with the French as I type this. Wee wee oh weeee weee sky. lika zat!! LOL anyway, um... that was weird.

We will see what the ellections hold and the soon after. It will be a blast in many ways. But so wasnt our civil war and independance war. We had no help. Funny how we end up helping other countries and they never help us out. Except GB and few others Australia. Well there are alot of good friends out there. I guess Australia is all a bunch of retards with an IQ of 30 right sky?

Alice Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 7:23 PM :
No, no happy hour. We don't like to that very often .. besides, I only have club soda with lime anyhow.

Alice Wrote the following on 01/21/2005 7:26 PM :
Another granp PoPo quote: "bearded towel headed potbelly sucker"

Glad to know that the police in this country are still racist. It's those little things that make this country great :(

Juniper Wrote the following on 01/22/2005 03:14 AM :
PoPo, hope you feel better soon!

We did help SADDAM INTO POWER! Man, just do a Google if you don't believe me! Have to point out also that there was a lot of foresight with Iraq, You forgot all about that? I remember the rest of the civilized world telling us it was a BIG MISTAKE to "bring democracy" to Iraq.

Hey don't say we never get helped out by other countries, they are most willing to help, but or we don't want it or we give them hell cause they dare think we can't do it ourselves. During indepence- and Civil war, no means to kill people on massive scale as today, and tools to do that also not as easy available as today.

As written at the beginning: "PoPo, your loyalty to our elected government is commendable" I have to add: Pitty they don't deserve it.

Sky Wrote the following on 01/22/2005 07:35 AM :
Never mind, PoPo. You are hopelessly entrenched -- the sign of a weak mind. Just continue believing all this weird shit. But while you are at it, please go get some psychiatric help. I tried (again!) to have a reasoned dialogue with you, and rather than doing in that spirit, you attacked and ranted on calling me names and trying to insult me. It is all you know how to do and shows that you have some major maturity issues. What upsets me is that you carry a badge and a gun!

Sky Wrote the following on 01/23/2005 6:38 PM :
Waaaaaaahhhhh!!! I hate PoPo!!! He insulted me!!!! Waaaaaahhhhhh!!!!

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/26/2005 3:57 PM :
Nuts cakes. Alice you realy think I am racist? LOL I hope you are kidding. If you see me as a racist you have a very poor judge of caracter. I am a first generation American. I father is from Yugoslavia, and my nany is do in June. When this black baby is born I sure hope I am no longer racist like you think I am, because I will have serious issues rasing a black daughter, being a white cop. LOL

Like I said, even if we as americans had something to do with Sadams place in power, that only reinforces our responsibility to remove that "mistake" from it since we created the monster. Thats if we are why he was in power. But that doe not mean we are why he is a mad man.

Juniper I think you need a check up from the neck up. Your post above is very confusing. And extremely biassed in your personal beleifes. So called expert on what countries deserve Democracy now? Alice are you with Juniper on this one? That Iraq cant have democracy? Is this what you have all come too?

Sky spare me your crap. LOL Your selfsentered fettish is why I used to be a heavy drinker. You are WAY TOO serious about your self buddy. Did you realy try to have another "reasoned dialog" with stupid liitle me again? Awwwww. Am I still stupid and little minded? Was I not intellectual enough for you or something Sky? SO in what way did I fail in debait with you sky? Lets see now....what could it be...

Well I failed to connect with the great Sky and his attempt to hold a "reasoned dialog" with a lowling like me was because I am entrenched in my ways....HHhhmmm. So in other words or in laymen's terms, "I still agree with Sky!!" And there for I have a week mind because I think you are wrong Sky!! Hah. Sky I wouldnt waste a good can of OC spray on you. I think you have your preconcieved ideas and at the center of each one is "Sky" and there for nothing else matters any way. As if I care what upsets poor Sky! Give your self a break and get a reality check "man". You are not that important. And yes its true I carry a badge at times and a gun at times, but what I carry around that means more than the rest is a real self awareness of my place in the world. You carry around an awareness of this place in YOUR world, that every one is weak minded and hopeless if they do not conform to your philosophy and dogmas. So self centered and crude.

I dont live by your measurements oh great Sky fakeness of greatest fake fakers. I live by my standards, and I answer to myself, not you or what you think. Like I said from the begaining sky. The more you type or talk the less you become convincable and ever less buy-able. You are so very full of it, and it is deffinately stinky.

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/26/2005 3:59 PM :
Major typo above^

I typed ,"I still agree with Sky!!" And there for I have a week mind because I think you are wrong Sky!!

It should read: "I still DO NOT agree with Sky!!" And there for I have a week mind because I think you are wrong Sky!!

Alice Wrote the following on 01/26/2005 3:59 PM :
PoPo, you used the phrase "towel head". How was I to take that? Was I to assume that person that uses this kind of phrase has love an respect for arabs? Or was I to assume that the twisted fuck that said it is a racist? You many not have problem with blacks, but you obviously have a major problem with arabs.

Nony Wrote the following on 01/26/2005 4:07 PM :
Popo, You feeling better or still sick?

If you read Juniper's post you will see he did not say anything about Iraq not deserving a Democracy, He only pointed out that we were warned about running into difficutlies bringing it to them (and we did, just look at the current rather embarrasing and bloody situation there). Are you a bit dyslectic PoPo? cause I have noticed before that you really misinterpret postings sometimes. My nephew has the same problem.

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/30/2005 5:04 PM :
Yes Alice I see your point now. I agree with you whole heartedly. With much respect I would like to point out to any one with half a brain, that I should not have used the words "towel head". When I used those words I was thinking in my mind of the zippis that we all love to hate, the ones who kidnapp innocent Americans or westerners and cut their necks praising their god. They are who I aimed those names at. HOWEVER, being that the term was created and is used to a race rather than a group of poeple with radical ideas, I am sorry to have used such braod and general terms of racism and hate to paint my pictures and points with. Can any one be man or mature enough to forgive me for my stupid mistake? PLEASE!!!

Please be advised that "Zippi" is not a racist term. It is the arabic word for dick. So get off my back.

Thanks Alice...I grew up around people of every culture in New Jersey, and realy and truly have no malice of any type for any "race" or "people". Only have hate for "sin", the "devil" who does exist in his hopeless state, yet is still real, and for "ideas of hate for groups of people because they are differant".

I hope I have given example of this statement of hate by appologizing in open forum with out excuse for using words of racist type hate.

And as for my statement about Junipers "statement" about who said whatever about bringing democracy to Iraq being a mistake----

I still have no problem with what I said. No he is not the ones who went around saying beforehand that it was a mistake, but he is bringing up the statemen to make a statement. Now lets see if you are smart enough to figure out "WHAT STATEMENT" he was getting at? GEEEEEE!!!! Let me think here!!! Yep I stand by my statement and defence that it does not matter what other countries say about our "USA's" choices are. They are not footing the bill! They are not suffering regularly as we from attacks everywhere for --NO REASON--, nor did they care or suffer like we did on September 11, 2001.

So again who cares what they think about our choice to bring Democracy to Iraq. We did not go into Iraq to bring them crap.

We went into Iraq to remove Sadam, whether or not we put him in power or helped or drove him to the big house or not, doesnt matter!!!!

They are being given Democracy because we removed their "ONLY" form of governement and leaving them in that state would not be fair.

So we are rebuilding their land whos damage is mostly due to the former devils hands of cruelty, not because of our quick and swift entery and overthrow of a terroristic governement.


And atleast I can make my own statement and stand by it, unlike Juniper who quotes some one elses accusations and aims them to me to prove the very same point int the statement, and then has some one else come defend him mistakenly.

Who the heck cares if we helped bring him to power!?!?! Dont you think that he as a polotician might have been tricky enough to bea wolf in sheeps clothing? Or that he might have had evil intentions and used US funds for greed himself? You realy think he was as dangerous to his nieghbors at that time? You think Democratic administrations did not have anything to do with his empowerment and our funding it????

Does it matter? Do people not have the ability to change for better or worse over time, and only then is it obvious what a mistake it is only to late? And is it not reasonable that we should be the ones to remove him from power if in fact we are responsible for putting him there? And therefor we have even more right to be in Iraq with or with out that sissy cakes sweet talken looser group of crooks the UN say so or not!!!???!!!

Geez yo!!! Reality check guys!! We are the richest, the most diverse, the most effective, the religiosly diverse, pillar of a country in the world!!!! Who better to be the police of the world than us??? Should the policing country be a country whos national religion is Muslem, and forbids other religions in its own borders? Should it be China???? What the heck people. Its so obvious we are the ones that most of the world looks up to any way. Why else do people flock to our borders and risk everything to sneak in legaly or not??? We are what the rest of the world population hopes to be. Wether or not our latest actions have been so popular or not. We are still the big protective brother whos intentions have usualy been for good. Helping out smaller countries who get bullied by Comunistic and sometimes Muslim tirrants is what we have done since almost day one.

Any way Im done ranting.

Nony Wrote the following on 01/31/2005 03:01 AM :
Saddam was already a real dictator with all the makings of delusions when we helped him PoPo, stop defending him.

Who better to police the world? good question, who is going to police the police to avoid abuse of policing power?

So are you personally THAT rich then PoPo? If you are hoping they will let you share in the richness of the nation... a disappointment is awaiting you. But the "american dream" is the carrot that holds you in line isn't it.

Juniper Wrote the following on 01/31/2005 08:04 AM :
PoPo, get a life! One idiot defending our mistakes is already enough. At least the other one can claim to have been elected. :-)

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/31/2005 09:05 AM :
LOL Nony you kill me man. What country do you live in? Talk is cheap pal. And you sound like a front runner for food stamps of cheap talk. EASY for you to say "WE", when you do not live the American life. There are Americans living in the actual country who avoid paying taxes and live off of welfare and freeload from each oportunity of gov help, and they still have more "right" to act as if they are apart of this "we" thing you so easily slap around as if you are actualy here in the states Nony. DO you pay taxes? Do you vote in US ellections?Do you invest into the US economy? Is your country helping in the Iraq reformation? SO why act as if you are apart of this "we" bulogna??!!

I never said anything stupid like that nony. How in the world do you get by in life? You must have help. You can barely get what it is Im saying in a simple commentary, how in the world do you make it through a day? As if I actualy said, Ill be the police of the world! LOL Which country do you think is better to remove Sadam from power? Lets see you come up with a better answer if you are so bright!

And Juniper Im not "defending our mistake" as you say. Im commenting on the world issue just like any one around the world can easily do, even the ones who are not living in America and use the "we" factor as if they had a right to.

Nony Wrote the following on 01/31/2005 09:30 AM :
Was me that someone, sorry PoPo, another case of PEBKAC

PoPo Wrote the following on 01/31/2005 2:08 PM :
Nony I guess I need to spell it out 4 U!!

LOL Old man!

I did NOT say that "... they are no longer part of the United States since they are living and working here." I said that YOUR opinions are phrased wrongly. I dont understand how you can say "we" in sentences refuring to what the United States does in Iraq.

#1 - because; yes, you do not live here any more, nor do you pay taxes on this war. Now it doesnt mean you are not a double your trouble citizen, it only means ">I DONT UNDERSTAND HOW YOU CAN SAY >WE< WHEN REFURING TO US ACTIONS IN IRAQ<"

And #2 - Also because of the obvious stand you take on not agreeing to America being there. People who agree and wanted us to get involved say things like "We are helping rebuild Iraq. We are invading Iraq. We are fighting terrorist in Iraq." Now people who dissagree say things in a differant way. I.E. "Monkey boy invaded Iraq for money or oil or goats milk. They are killing babies and old people in the streets of Iraq for sport, and humor. They think they can go in and fight the whole world over black money." Using the "second person words" like, they, them, it, he, and she.



Nony Wrote the following on 01/31/2005 2:20 PM :
Double your trouble citizen, I kind of like that "young man" Thanks for spelling it out, will use the "PoPo approved way of commenting for non-agreeing citizens living in foreign countries" next time!

Man you crack me up, could barely get this typed.

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